Apologies for the mistake about the filters. By "old" I simply meant that they have been around for some time and I already have them on 2.6.11. I assumed that Partha's versions are an indication of what's going to be in 2.8 but I was wrong. Admittedly there are a few improvements that I missed out - I didn't notice them because I don't generally use them. My criticism of 2.8 may have sounded a bit harsh but my point remains that, considering how long we've been waiting, improvements are minimal and disappointing and I prefer 2.6.11 and will be sticking to it for as long as possible. Don't feel criticised, PhotoComix - these are great filters and I use them regularly, especially G'MIC, I mentioned them simply because we already have them and don't need 2.8 in order to use them.

As i wrote i got that was not your intention to attack, i just used the occasion to clarify



Wrong ? yes and not
partha version is based on beta releases very close to the coming 2.8 , but may contain bugs (maybe also regarding the cage tool, not sure about) that will be fixed before the official 2.8 release

The Partha portable (only the portable the "standard" version doesn't contain 3rd party add on ) and even more my "Windows Friendly" version (BTW this last not officially released but if you want try .. just send me a PM ) are a indication of how Partha will PACKAGE his 2.8-portable and on how i will package my "Windows Friendly" version

There are not and never were official builds of gimp but many consider that from Sergei on Sourceforge almost official,
and he may well not share the vision of Partha (i.e. include python support, and so python by default ) and even less mine,( that is similar but far more extremist) about packaging

but better so:
users would have more chose ranging from a streamlined version (without the Help, without Python, without PDF support but more official even if officially is not so) that of Partha and mine (that in few days will be hosted also in the partha blog) what more adapt to their exigences and taste

Mmmm- I think python support by default is a great idea. You mailed me about your version a while ago and I have yet to try it as I'm on an expensive PAYG dongle and can't download large files until I can get on my mate's computer. I'll certainly give it a go but I hope it's portable as I don't want to mess up my present installation (2.6.11)

There's tons of improvements in 2.8 compared to 2.6 that are anything but minimal - for one, layer groups. I have some files with around 200 layers and those are a bitch to navigate, layer groups will help with that a lot. And not only that, they actually add new functionality: you can combine layers within a layer group with different layer modes, then you can set the entire group to some layer mode and combine it to lower layers... in this way, you can interactively "stack" different layer modes, which is something that you previously could not do in any convenient way.

Another thing is the new brush dynamics engine, which is a million times more advanced than the one in 2.6 - especially if you do any digital drawing/painting. The smooth stroke option is also extremely useful for drawing.

Now if I could just get a version that would work properly, without hanging up or slowing or having weird chunky artifacts when panning... I'd be extremely happy.

@ERICSIAN

For the last point no any problem my version may run alongside any other gimp version

It is EASILY portable :
it is fully self contained and may perfectly run as portable taking care of 1 , only 1 detail:
do not set preference paths outside the program folders

The equivalent of the gimp user folder (= the .gimp-2.7 folder with the dot before the name ) is inside already clearly visible and organized to host at best users add on.

Another detail (but is generic for many portable ) is, in win 7 and Vista, AVOID to install it in PROGRAM FILES, because the lock of Windows on that directory ...any other place (just C..or Document...or what else) is fine

About the gigantic file size

1) the culprit is the HELP :
the HELP contain all the language files (including chinese, jap, armenian, swahili...) because i can't make a different version for each language
BUT i may well make a English version that would have a much more reasonable file size

2) Anyway will be soon available also as torrent file, torrent are much more reliable (and much faster) to download large files and even more important MUCH MORE SAFE (we talk about "licit" torrent):
With normal download often happen to get corrupted files, only way to check is check the MD5 but almost nobody does
With torrent the minimal divergence from the original file, even 1 single kb lost, raise a immediate alarm (= incomplete download) also is much easier and safe interrupt and resume dl

Not a case that the major linux distro suggest to use torrent to download their products

We already have layer groups as a third party script and have had them for a long time. The brush engine has potential, but smooth strokes were available with Gimp Painter and if you want a rotating brush, you can make an animated pipe brush. In its potential, I agree - the engine is good but at the moment, the difference it makes to artists (and I'm one of them so I'm on the look out for such things) is minimal.

PhotoComix - thanks for that. I've just tried the new text tool and I must admit, I love it! I'm beginning to warm to 2.8 but those tool sliders need sorting out, they are next to impossible to control.

In the link I started this thread with it says:
Quote:
-GIMP 2.7 is fully backward compatible to all earlier GIMP 2.x version.
+GIMP 2.8 is fully backward compatible to all earlier GIMP 2.x version.
Plug-ins and scripts written for GIMP 2.6 or earlier GIMP 2.x versions
will continue to work and don't need to be changed nor recompiled to
-be used with GIMP 2.7.
+be used with GIMP 2.8.

NOT TRUE!
Gerard.

not yet :
the "compatibility layer" that should assure backward compatibility would be one of the last thing to be implemented

anyway in other occasion (2.2 & 2.4) was also one of the thing that was NEVER implemented, so your concern may have a good grounding

Here's the proof. You can see from the scrollbar that I couldn't get the whole tool options box on my screen. If you are interested in the layer groups script, you can download it from http://registry.gimp.org/node/16563

The "compatibility layer" is already implemented, however, it is intentionally disabled by default during the development cycle to assist the developers in developing the development version (which is the purpose of the development cycle). Non-developers are free to enable compatibility if they so choose; but the developers are concerned with developing the development versions, not making things convenient for non-developers to use development versions.


With but a couple of exceptions, all problems of running pre-2.4 scripts on GIMP 2.4 (and 2.6) were owing to those scripts taking advantage of the earlier Script-fu's forgiving nature. A well-written script under GIMP 2.2 ran fine on GIMP 2.4 (it's just that not many scripts were that well written).

Thanks for the explanation saulgoode.
However http://www.gimpusers.com/news/00408-gim ... before-2-8
gave me the impression that it would work ok.
Can you tell me how I can enable this compatability layer please?
Gerard.

Gerard,

I think you start Gimp in the compatibility mode:



Partha

ikke@Gerard ~ $ /usr/bin/gimp-2.7 ----pdb-compat-mode
Unknown option ----pdb-compat-mode
ikke@Gerard ~ $
As you can see it doesn't work.
Thanks anyway.
Gerard.

Edit: I noticed the 4 dashes and tried again with 2.

The default setting for development versions of GIMP is "warn".

Ok, no. That "layer group" script sucks. I tried it once and deleted it pretty much straight away, it's nigh uncomprehensible, and besides - it does not provide the same functionality that real layer groups do, as it does not allow you to stack blend modes.

What I'm talking about is, with real layer groups, you can make group A, and add layers 1 and 2 inside it. Then you can set layer 2 on normal, and layer 1 above it on multiply, and then set group A on grain merge (for example). Now, the result is, that first layer 1 will be multiplied with layer 2, and then the result of the multiplication will be grain merged with whatever is below group A. This is not possible with 2.6, even with the crappy "layer groups" script. You can also nest layer groups within each other, so that's another thing.

Also, yeah you can make rotating brushes in 2.6, but it's limited to 100 angles, and you can't set it to be controlled by any other thing than brush direction. Anyway, the new brush dynamics provide many more functions, for example you can set curves on each dynamic. This allows you much more control over the dynamics than the old dynamics settings. You can create very diverse dynamics settings with the new dynamics, things that were impossible in 2.6 - and even things that were possible are much easier and more convenient to use.

Also, gimppainter had smooth strokes - so what? They're not in 2.6 and I think we were talking about differences between 2.6 and 2.8.

The point I was making was that nearly everything new in 2.8 was available to us already for 2.6.11 and is just a reworking of old scripts and plugins. After years of waiting, I expected better. Just how many angles does an artist need for his brush? When I paint in acrylics, my brush doesn't rotate at all yet I can still paint with it. When you look at new features, ask yourself "what practical good is that?" You might be into gimmicks but I would prefer practical improvements.

The point I was making was that there are tons of things in 2.8 that are not really possible in 2.6, such as actual, real layer groups and the new functionality they provide. Also like I said the new brush dynamics do much more than just provide "more angles", I've no idea why you stuck to that part of my post and ignored everything else... the improvements in 2.8 are very much practical improvements, they improve the workflow and make things easier. Does every new feature have to do something amazing and new? I'd rather get improvements to the old features to make them easier to use and more powerful.

I'm sorry, but it kind of sounds like you're looking a gift horse in the mouth. You'd want there to be tons of new and amazing things in gimp because you've had to "wait for years"... well, did you consider that the people who have been working on this new version for years are doing it pro-bono, and they all probably have to make a living too, they all have to have jobs/school because developing gimp doesn't make them any money?

In a perfect world, we'd have some benevolent billionaire set up a huge trust fund to hire all the gimp developers to work on gimp full-time. Sadly, they've yet to come accross such a billionaire...

Have to confess I did not know about the compatibility layer, the pop-up messages were quite alarming with my previous 2.7.5

This latest compile however is looking good, It is on my video editing machine, so not much time so far spent setting it up, but to date, what is working

Liquid rescale, G'mic, mathmap, resynthesise, as a script test just tried Saul Goodes warp text, a bit slow but it got there. Not an error message in sight.

On the trivial side as an example , here is sg-warp text, then mathmap droste applied to it.

I will concede that the layer groups are a good addition if you need to use a ton of layers. I am not criticising the brush engine, I am just saying that it holds no advantage for me as I can do most of those things already. I've already said in this thread that I appreciate the work that these people do. It is possible to criticise a concept without attacking the people involved. As for everything else, I think we can agree to disagree before the discussion becomes reduced to bickering. I sense tension in your post and I would prefer to get along with you. Please don't judge me over a difference of opinion.

Is this a quarrel ?
Better is the enemy worse - but our own habits are the strongest in practice.
I recommend installing both versions - both versions can be simultaneously
as required:
http://www.gimpchat.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=970&start=190#p48739